"WebForms is a lie. It’s abstraction wrapped in deception
covered in lie sauce presented on a plate full of diversion
and sleight of hand.
Nothing you do with Webforms has anything to do with the web
– you let it do the work for you."
i've been programming for 45+ years ... imho, it's no longer possible to slow
down the rate at which one falls behind, at least for most of us.
i've embraced TDD/technology facing testing using xUnit.net and
website application building with ASP.NET MVC 3 ... but that means
nothing at all except for things that i build for myself ... if you're
really lucky, you might get to work for Jeff Atwood and help
evolve the ASP.NET MVC based stackoverflow.com, or you
might get to work on codeplex.com where you'd get to use
Jim Newkirk's xUnti.net ...
but, sadly, for most "jobs", somebody is going to tell you
to use WebForms and not to bother with TDD ... "they"
may even have you write a few token and meaningless
unit tests using MSTest just to be able to claim that
their applications are being developed by "agile" teams.
choroomi, your confusion is totally understandable ...
Silverlight is likely to be washed away by HTML5 ...
choroomi
is this just an UI platform and everything behaind that will be the same.
... and when "management" does more than play lip service to concepts like training, usability, et cetera.
[do not hold your breath]
regards ~~ gerry (lowry)
B-) Please help me by completing my school survey about computer programmers on my website. Thank you!!! Gerry Lowry +1 705-429-7550 wasaga beach, ontario, canada
Should I switch to develop Apps with {HTML, JS, CSS} | {C#, VB} for UI and WCF,
LINQ, SQL Server for server-side layers?
Or Should I learn MVC as fast as possible and keep web development as I've done so far (but with MVC not WebForms)?
Amin, if i had "the answer" to your question, i would not be looking for telecommuting work at the moment ... instead, people would be paying me to talk at i.t. conferences, mentor development teams,
et cetera.
imho, no one has "the answer", because there are too many factors controlling present and future outcomes.
let me explain ... in the 45+ years that i've been programming, i've seen many great technologies come and go, as well as technologies like
APL and J never get the acceptance that they deserve.
a few generalized examples (my own biased opinions):
Linux being free split the PC world into Microsoft and Linux universes
PL/I died because IBM introduced it
OS/2 died because Windows won
c++ is mortally wounded in the Windows world by c#, and in the Linux world by Java
xUnit.net is growing slowly because MSTest has marketing lead and NUnit has greater inertia
ASP.NET MVC 3 is growing slowly because WebForms is entrenched in the Windows world
APL never caught on because people are afraid of anything that looks too mathematical
TDD/technology facing tests is ignored because management would rather rush product to market quickly even if they have to pay many times the price of using TDD because they do not have the
regression tests and robustness that TDD delivers
management fails to realize that just because they have their applications written in one technology, there is no reason why new applications can not be delivered in newer, better technologies
et cetera
OPTIONS: pick the technology where today's jobs happen to be (WebForms) while learning the technology where you'll find tomorrow's jobs (ASP.NET MVC 3 and later).
try to work for companies that are not driven by the status quo
BE THE BEST YOU CAN BE at core technologies like
HTML and CSS, c# and LINQ to Entities,
xUnit.net and moq, et cetera
Amin, the answers to your questions depend on so many factors, even including what you already know and where you live geographically ...
the above comments are my opinions based upon my worldview .... YMMV
free advice is worth what you pay for it, sometimes more, often less
Ultimately, Amin, you need to make those decisions that will make you happiest and wealthiest, and if you're lucky both ... it's easy to choose
happiness over wealth until the rent or mortgage becomes due and there's no money to pay it and next thing you know, you and your family are homeless.
gerry
B-) Please help me by completing my school survey about computer programmers on my website. Thank you!!! Gerry Lowry +1 705-429-7550 wasaga beach, ontario, canada
I've been a windows and web developer for like 8 years and now I dont know what to do with windows 8 and metro style apps?
Learn what MetroStyle apps is all about, and then work out if that form of development will help solve problems that your existing skills toolset can't solve. If it does, use it when appropriate. It's never a case of either/or.
OPTIONS: pick the technology where today's jobs happen to be (WebForms) while learning the technology where you'll find tomorrow's jobs (ASP.NET MVC 3 and later).
try to work for companies that are not driven by the status quo
BE THE BEST YOU CAN BE at core technologies like
HTML and CSS, c# and LINQ to Entities,
xUnit.net and moq, et cetera
Amin, the answers to your questions depend on so many factors, even including what you already know and where you live geographically ...
Thanks again gerrylowry,
Something you dont know about me is that I dont work for somebody else. I work for my own company.
And my company sells software to customers. I have the complete authority to choose the tools, platforms and technology. So as you see the job and manager undrestandings is not my issue.
I assume that I'm gonna start MVC and develop web application by that from now on.
choroomi
Member
33 Points
31 Posts
Where is ASP .NET in metrostyle apps?
Nov 12, 2011 01:03 PM|LINK
I am so confused about the future of software development.
I've been a windows and web developer for like 8 years and now I dont know what to do with windows 8 and metro style apps?
Should I leave everything I know about "WindowsForms, WebForms, ASP.NET, Silverlight, ..." behind and start learning Developing Metrostyle Apps?
Or is this just an UI platform and everything behaind that will be the same.
Should I use Cloud Services, or can I use SQL Server and WCF as a Data Provider for Metrostyle Apps?
I'll be very greatful if somebody leads me to the right direction.
Thanks a lot
Vanda Developers Co.
gerrylowry
All-Star
20515 Points
5713 Posts
Re: Where is ASP .NET in metrostyle apps?
Nov 13, 2011 08:38 AM|LINK
@ choroomi
http://blog.wekeroad.com/blog/i-spose-ill-just-say-it-you-should-learn-mvc
"WebForms is a lie. It’s abstraction wrapped in deception
covered in lie sauce presented on a plate full of diversion
and sleight of hand.
Nothing you do with Webforms has anything to do with the web
– you let it do the work for you."
i've been programming for 45+ years ... imho, it's no longer possible to slow
down the rate at which one falls behind, at least for most of us.
i've embraced TDD/technology facing testing using xUnit.net and
website application building with ASP.NET MVC 3 ... but that means
nothing at all except for things that i build for myself ... if you're
really lucky, you might get to work for Jeff Atwood and help
evolve the ASP.NET MVC based stackoverflow.com, or you
might get to work on codeplex.com where you'd get to use
Jim Newkirk's xUnti.net ...
but, sadly, for most "jobs", somebody is going to tell you
to use WebForms and not to bother with TDD ... "they"
may even have you write a few token and meaningless
unit tests using MSTest just to be able to claim that
their applications are being developed by "agile" teams.
choroomi, your confusion is totally understandable ...
Silverlight is likely to be washed away by HTML5 ...
what's behind "could" change when "management" finally sees the value of LINQ over SQL: http://www.linqpad.net/WhyLINQBeatsSQL.aspx
... and when "management" does more than play lip service to concepts like training, usability, et cetera.
[do not hold your breath]
regards ~~ gerry (lowry)
choroomi
Member
33 Points
31 Posts
Re: Where is ASP .NET in metrostyle apps?
Nov 13, 2011 11:38 AM|LINK
@ gerrylowry
Thanks a lot for you consideration. I've recently figured out what a big mistake I'd made by choosing Webforms and not using MVC.
But now I'm still confused about what's gonna happen when windows 8 and Metrostyle Apps release.
Should I switch to develop Apps with {HTML, JS, CSS} | {C#, VB} for UI and WCF, LINQ, SQL Server for server-side layers?
Or Should I learn MVC as fast as possible and keep web development as I've done so far (but with MVC not WebForms)?
Can you help me out with that confusion?
Regards,
Amin Choroomi
Vanda Developers Co.
gerrylowry
All-Star
20515 Points
5713 Posts
Re: Where is ASP .NET in metrostyle apps?
Nov 13, 2011 03:18 PM|LINK
@ choroomi
Amin, if i had "the answer" to your question, i would not be looking for telecommuting work at the moment ... instead, people would be paying me to talk at i.t. conferences, mentor development teams, et cetera.
imho, no one has "the answer", because there are too many factors controlling present and future outcomes.
let me explain ... in the 45+ years that i've been programming, i've seen many great technologies come and go, as well as technologies like APL and J never get the acceptance that they deserve.
a few generalized examples (my own biased opinions):
et cetera
OPTIONS: pick the technology where today's jobs happen to be (WebForms) while learning the technology where you'll find tomorrow's jobs (ASP.NET MVC 3 and later).
try to work for companies that are not driven by the status quo
BE THE BEST YOU CAN BE at core technologies like HTML and CSS, c# and LINQ to Entities, xUnit.net and moq, et cetera
Amin, the answers to your questions depend on so many factors, even including what you already know and where you live geographically ...
the above comments are my opinions based upon my worldview .... YMMV
free advice is worth what you pay for it, sometimes more, often less
Ultimately, Amin, you need to make those decisions that will make you happiest and wealthiest, and if you're lucky both ... it's easy to choose happiness over wealth until the rent or mortgage becomes due and there's no money to pay it and next thing you know, you and your family are homeless.
gerry
Mikesdotnett...
All-Star
154927 Points
19867 Posts
Moderator
MVP
Re: Where is ASP .NET in metrostyle apps?
Nov 14, 2011 06:37 AM|LINK
Learn what MetroStyle apps is all about, and then work out if that form of development will help solve problems that your existing skills toolset can't solve. If it does, use it when appropriate. It's never a case of either/or.
Beginning ASP.NET Web Pages with WebMatrix | My Site | Twitter
choroomi
Member
33 Points
31 Posts
Re: Where is ASP .NET in metrostyle apps?
Nov 14, 2011 12:25 PM|LINK
Thanks again gerrylowry,
Something you dont know about me is that I dont work for somebody else. I work for my own company.
And my company sells software to customers. I have the complete authority to choose the tools, platforms and technology. So as you see the job and manager undrestandings is not my issue.
I assume that I'm gonna start MVC and develop web application by that from now on.
Thank you so much.
Vanda Developers Co.