CSS Friendly Control Adapters

Re: RTM

Thacker — Fri, 24 Nov 2006 21:59:54 GMT

Russ--

I have, on each occasion of contact with you, commended your undertaking. I have freely stated that I wouldn't have wanted your job for love nor money even if I had your expertise which I have admitted and do, still, admit that I do not have. I can nor could I find any fault with your work product.

What I do take exception, and take strong exception, is a platform [Microsoft Visual Studio 2005 and the controls/adapters supplied with the same] that freely promote standards and accessibility compliance, out of the box, when in fact they do not.

Again, Russ, I have not nor am I taking exception to your work product. It is my expressed opinion that time constraints came into play and that Microsoft could have and should have allocated sufficient resources to meet this constraint if such were the case. If your logic was not based upon time constraints or something of a similar nature, then I do take exception to it with deference.

Personally, I do not need an explanation on the mind-set or logic used as to why basics of accessibility cannot or were not met. I am sure however that the disabled United States Marine, the young diabetic girl who is now an amputee and losing her eyesight or the memory of Christopher Reeves, who advocated accessibility standards so gallantly before the United States Congress, would love an explanation.

There are many content developers who do not have the expertise to build or modify the 'printing press' [adapters] that are used to render their content. Albeit, there are commercially available controls/adapters that do meet such standards.

It is hoped with great speed and urgency that Microsoft will carry forward, immediately, on the groundwork that you have set forth with these adapters. Accessible Web content is direly needed along with the tools to create the same. ASP.NET is one hell of a platform but basics are needed before the 'dancing bear'.

The World Wide Web belongs to everyone regardless of economics, geography or disability.

Sincerely,

Thacker

Re: RTM

Russ Helfand — Fri, 24 Nov 2006 18:00:45 GMT

Hi Thacker,

As I said in the announcement of RTM, not everything could be addressed. Tab order was one of the things that I decided had to wait. I know you consider this basic and critical. Others don't share that view and really needed the RTM to come out for other reasons. Personally, I don't think it's fair to condemn the whole kit because of this omission but that is for you to decide, of course.

I do want to thank you for you passionate advocacy of various parts of the kit. Your encouragement led to making certain other enhancements a priority for beta 3 (e.g., beginning to address access key issues).

Perhaps if/when other versions of the kit are released you'll return and give them a try.

Regards,

Re: RTM

aldwis — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 17:06:55 GMT

Nice job!

I'll update in time!

Re: RTM

Thacker — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 16:46:05 GMT

Am I missing something with Visual Studio 2005, the ASP.NET platform, the CSS Friendly Adapters --- but it sure looks likes all this stuff, out of the box, is still device dependent. Linear tab order is not even recognized. If such is the case, the basics haven't even been met. If I am wrong, someone please enlighten me.

Re: RTM

bgold — Wed, 22 Nov 2006 20:12:17 GMT

This is a super-exciting release, one I've been looking forward to for a long time. Creating a set of samples that shows how the adapter architecture can truly enable anyone to control the finest details of ASP.NET 2.0 was a personal goal and doing it by making that rendering super friendly for CSS and standards based design was the clearest high-value way to do it. I think these adapters are a huge release for ASP.NET developers and I know I'll be adopting them in most of the development I do going forward. Let us know what you think, contiunue to provide feedback, and especially help us figure out what to do next (there are many options, whether related to this suite of adapters or others).

Good luck with them and enjoy.

-Brian

RTM

Russ Helfand — Wed, 22 Nov 2006 16:26:10 GMT

RTM. For those of you not familiar with those three magical letters, they stand for Release To Manufacturing. Years ago, when software was exclusively distributed in physical media, like diskettes, RTM was literally the moment when the developers released (sent) a well tested, reasonably robust version of their work to the manufacturing plant that duplicated it on the physical medium and boxed it up for customers to buy.

Though we now distribute most software electronically (and, thus, avoid the whole "manufacturing" stage) we still like to use the term RTM. Now it translates to a release that isn't beta any longer; it is better than that; it's ready for "release" to the general public.

I'm very pleased to announce that the CSS Friendly adapters have reached the RTM stage. Today we've released the first official non-beta version, 1.0. It's available, as usual, at http://www.asp.net/cssadapters.

In order make RTM as stable as possible, we limited the number of changes we allowed ourselves to make to the last beta (3.0). Here are the main things that are new in RTM.

ASP.NET AJAX
Added control's ID as an attribute in the adapted rendering to support UpdatePanel, etc.

Standards and Accessibility
readonly attribute's value is readonly, not true.

Membership
Use client script form submission to support the "link" button type.

Menus
Removed line break before close of anchor and span tags (was causing white space to appear in the browser).
Removed superfluous CSS\BrowserSpecific\IEMenu7.css.
Fixed IE7 "ghost" menus.
Eliminated IEMenu7.css (no special rules are needed any longer for IE7).

TreeView
Removed line break before close of anchor and span tags (was causing white space to appear in the browser).
Allow multiple TreeView instances on the same page (by registering each submit script separately).
Support TreeView.ShowExpandCollapse.

GridView
Support HeaderStyle.CssClass, FooterStyle.CssClass and RowStyle.CssClass.
(Uncomment code block in GridView adapter to support attributes on rows).

DetailsView and FormView
Support TableRow.Visible.

As a hidden little goodie for the future, we made some small changes to be sure that the kit runs out-of-the-box (without any need for more modification) on Vista using IIS7.

But despite trying, we could not cram every idea (even every really great idea) into this new version of the adapter kit. I take full responsibility for this. There were some truly excellent ideas submitted on this forum and to me privately by email. I did my best to integrate and use the majority of this feedback. I failed in several cases, however, to use what were completely legitimate and worthy suggestions for ways to make the kit better. That is my fault, no one at Microsoft or elsewhere is responsible for those omissions. In particular, I want to acknowledge the brilliant work being done by the "Falcon" and to lament that I didn't have a chance to convert the DetailsView to use DL/DT.

There are lots of folks at Microsoft who will be monitoring the community's reaction to this adapter kit to help decide its future. Folks like Scott Guthrie, Brian Goldfarb and others are constantly traveling to conferences and love to chat with web devs "in the trenches." Feel free to track them down when they are in your neighborhood and tell them what's important to you.

For technical matters, including ongoing bug discoveries and contributions of suggested code changes, please continue to post on this forum. I'll try to remain in touch but its clear that others in the community are now answering lots of these kinds of questions... and that's the very best I could hope for.

Heidi and I want to extend our thanks to Microsoft for their support of this project and we want to thank the community of developers, many of whom hang out here. Your persistence, patience and help have been absolutely essential. We would not be at RTM now without your generous help over this last year. Thank you. Enjoy this RTM.