Tyler...

Seriously, take this offline now!!! You are only damaging yourself and your reputation.
Don't do this crap in a public forum. Simply request any inquiries to be directed to you offline and you can deal with the issues the way you see fit on a case by case basis.

The audience is here primarily because this is a FREE Open Source unrestricted project and you will be banging your head forever regardless of how simple and obvious the rules and your position are.

Let this thread die... Everyone knows and should respect your position.

Ugh... apparently, I'm not typing slow enough for some people.

Dearest IcthusTech:

"...By your definition of Royalty Free, anything distriubted under those terms must not be altered in any way..."

I don't remember defining "royalty free" anywhere in this thread or elsewhere. The only mention of term "royalty free" in the skinning contest rules states that "...By submitting an entry, you are releasing your entry to DotNetNuke for royalty free distribution..." This means that once I've submitted a contest skin, DotNetNuke has permission to distribute that skin to its users without having to pay me royalties. It does not have any implications whatsoever for downloaders of the skin, who are subject to the same copyright laws as the rest of the world, as much as they'd like to think otherwise.

"...Most Royalty Free agreements I have come accross..."

...do not apply to this contest, and are therefore irrelevant to this discussion. Next...

"...if you obtained them from any other source, I hope you left them intact in the original size, without any additional layers or modifications..."

I had full permission from the photographer to use that image for any purpose, commercial or otherwise. I also have permission to modify it! Pretty cool, huh? Sadly, you don't have my full permission to use that skin for any purpose. See the difference?

From the ReadMe.txt file distributed with every contest skin downloaded from DotNetNuke.com:

"While the skins are freely available for download, this does not change the fact that the original author is the copyright holder... The author has only given DotNetNuke the right to distribute this skin..."

Pretty self-explanatory, it would seem. They are freely available for download, not for modification and publication, and certainly not for resale.

SmartSource-IT,

I understand where you're coming from. Unfortunately, if I dealt with these issues on a case-by-case basis, I'd have no more time for cocaine, hookers, or my bible studies group.

I know that those of us who have worked with graphic designers in the past, or who have a concrete grasp of the English language are able to see that this is a cut-and-dry issue. But it appears that a sizable minority exists out there that has trouble understanding these simple concepts.

I don't really see this particular thread as being a professional, rational dialogue. But I'm having fun with it, so I've kept posting. This thread was a great opportunity to exercise my acid tongue, and throw a few thinly-veiled cheap shots while I'm at it!

Anyone who has worked with me knows that when it comes to my work, I am very thorough and professional. But part of my reputation is also my low tolerance for ignorance and reluctance to bite my tongue.

Well, kids... I don't think I have too much more to babble about on this subject, so I think I will stop posting until a new thread about midgets and/or explosions appears.

Time to go grab a pint or two. Or nine.

Intresting subject.

The copyright laws are intresting! So if you copy this text you have violited the copyright, I dont have to tell you its copyright

So I think all of us break the laws now and then :)

Tyler Fawcett has all rights to the skin and can claim his copyright without a word about it.
If I copy the code from its css or html I break the rules as well.
If I read the code and type it in myself again I dont!!

Another thing is.

At the bottom at dotnetnuke its stated

Portal engine source code is copyright © 2002-2004 by DotNetNuke. All Rights Reserved
This is not true in a sense, in the license all copyright is whithdrown but the copyright notice have to bee in the code.
If I retype the code I can acording to the copyright laws make my own copyright whitout any notice. (Moraly I am then ded :) )

This laws are the same at least in Europe and US at my knowledge. All countries that have signed the Berne Convention if I remember right.

© Jan Olsmar

Tyler,

You may have some very valid points, however I find your name calling and general tone to be distasteful and uncalled for. I took the time to find your site and write as a courtesy to what I believed was a free skin to the community. This was in my mind just to reinforce what I though would be ok.

I have removed your skin from my site.

On a personal note:

...my reputation is also my low tolerance for ignorance...

How do you live with yourself? It is my opinion that in this thread you have shown your "true colors".

Back to my "sturdy coffee table"

Don't worry Tyler, I have never nore will never use your skins.

Tyler,

Over the past year my business Active iNet Services has evolved in that DNN has become a cornerstone. I routinely build large web applications for businesses using DNN as the foundation. The DNN forums, Free Modules I release, and free skins I give away have all been great marketing tools. I must say with your responses in this thread were increadibly unprofessional and very counter productive to using the forums as marketing tool. You one the skinning contest and earn credibility in the community now many look negatively upon you.

Personaly, I agree with Scott (Mr. Swoops) your work is your work and people should respect your wishes. For example, downloaded it and use it as is. By bragging about how much you like to run your mouth and argue you have demonstrated a total lack of respect for others in the community. People using your skin were doing so b/c they liked it. How difficult is it to get people to agree on anything? The fact that so many people like your skin should be flattering.

My point is this you could have respectively asked people to not modify you skin without permission and not made enemies. You could have offered some kind of "Winning Skin Customization Special" thus drumming up business instead of bitching at everyone that modified.

You burned bridges and that is never good.

Cher dbottjer,

"...free skins I give away have all been great marketing tools..."

Luckily, I don't have to give away my product in order to create a demand for it. The quality of the work, as well as my professionalism in business dealings (despite your assessment of my conduct in this forum as being "increadibly" unprofessional) is what sells my product. Which isn't to say that I don't offer free skins (which I do) or provide skins for non-profit groups (which I have), or answer every skinning question that appears in my mailbox. But I do these things to give back to the DNN community, not as a marketing tool.

"...your work is your work and people should respect your wishes..."

I couldn't agree more. Unfortunately, there are others who think that my work is their work. That it why this thread exists. If everyone respected copyrights, we wouldn't be three pages into this thread.

"...By bragging about how much you like to run your mouth..."

Hmmm.... don't remember bragging about anything, but if you say so.

"...you have demonstrated a total lack of respect for others in the community..."

Don't assume that everyone in the community deserves my, or anyone else's, respect. Anyone who understands how black and white this issue is can see that this "argument" was over before it started and was following this thread, as I was, purely for entertainment purposes.

"...The fact that so many people like your skin should be flattering..."

Just as the fact that so many people took the skin and defaced it is disheartening. I'm not here to be flattered. I'm glad that so many people liked the skin, but disappointed that so many ignored my requests to use it according to the contest rules.

"...you could have respectively asked people to not modify you skin without permission and not made enemies..."

I did ask people respectfully not to modify the skin. Several times. Don't think that this is the first time this issue has arisen. Tranquility has been downloaded over 8 billion times (approximately) since the contest ended, and only a handful of those downloaders have chose not to heed the accompanying disclaimer, so here we are. I'm not here to make friends, I'm here to ensure that my work is not illegally reproduced and published.

"...You could have offered some kind of "Winning Skin Customization Special" thus drumming up business instead of bitching at everyone that modified."

Since this thread started, I've had an inbox full of mail from people who totally agree with me and have requested custom skin quotes. And who do you think are the more valuable clients:

A) Those who understand copyright laws, as well as artistic integrity, and are willing to spend modest amounts to ensure that the product they receive is 100% legitimate?

B) Humourless cranks?

My bottom line isn't winning friends in here (in case that hasn't been made obvious yet) but to ensure that my clients are looked after. This includes people that have paid to use Tranquility in a commercial setting.

"...You burned bridges and that is never good..."

Any bridges that I burned today were probably not worth crossing to begin with.

mmm

jan has a point here, as many of the sites aroundon the internet all are inspired somewhat by a new design so if people seem to like that tranquility that much ( I don't just too obvious and overused )

why dont any of us create a new one, lets call it "louthmoud" look at some photoshop tutorial site how to make these tipical 3d inlays there are plenty of tutorials about his kind of 3 styles add in a white background a photo topa nd some swirrley lines. Plenty of sites that use this, i had a similr setup for the top with one of my dnn1 skins ( if someone still remmebers big purple, hey it was the favourite color of a friend of mine and it was her site ;)

Ill see about looking that one up and wrapping soem 3d border thing around it and release it ( after my dnn3 cenversion that is just too much fun at the moment :)

mmm

talking about allt hese matters I always knew I have seen that concept before, ( been taking website screenshots for over 6 year now great for inspiration and ideas )

so after going through thousands and thousands of site here ya go

design by very well known flash agency well before dnn skin contest
skyworks

tranquilityskin

3d border with those dots around the edges mmm.

Now if soemone wraps this around another skin the loudmouth skin is born ;)

OK... I've removed all "tranquility" skins from my sites. But I'm really pissed because I spent a lot of time modifying it. It's not because of legality issues that I'm removing it; if you have read this whole post you’ll understand my reasons! I just don’t want to be associated with “tranquility”…

All I can say is thank the Heavens we have someone like Nina in this community!

You take the good
You take the bad
You take 'em both
And then you have

The facts of life
The facts of life

There's a time
You gotta go and
Show you're growin'
Know you know about

The facts of life
The facts of life

When the world never seems
To be livin' up to your dreams
And suddenly you're findin' out
The facts of life are all about you

It takes a lot to get it right
When you're learnin' the facts of life
The facts of life

My land is bare of chattering folk;
the clouds are low along the ridges,
and sweet's the air with curly smoke
from all my burning bridges.

Dorothy Parker (1893 - 1967), SANCTUARY


Bridges burning gladly, merging with the shadows

Pink Floyd


You give Canadian Soccer Coaching Guitar Players a bad name.

TJ

:)

Hmm, Taylor Fawcett hmm
Its not good to tell other not to break copyright rules if you dont work after them yourself.

At least you have to tell us thet the poem was written by Alan Thikle,Gloria Loring and Al Burton.

Its a good manner among artists not to take others material and make it your own :)

Jan O